kulaszne Cemetery

[bobby]

Hi, it was suggested that i post my question in this forum.

A ancestor of mine is buried in Kulaszne. He was shot from eviction regulations in 1946. I know nothing further than that.

I was sent the photo below, but dont know where the cemetery is, or the name/address of the cemetery, or what army he was in, although i do have a closeup photo of him with his army uniform on.

My other Kuper ancestors should also be buried in Kulaszne, and i assume there would only be 1 cemetery their?

http://38.114.207.13/496a9bd40106411b2ed271b1eb9ed7895g.jpg

[vm2301]

Hi,

I've been there a few times, but to tell you the truth do not remember it too well. There is a new church ( here's the link to the artcile & a photo - unfortunately in Polish:http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kulaszne).

The old graveyard is located near this church which has been built on the place of the old one - it burnt in the 1970s. Driving there it is impossible to overlook it.

Among the names of the residents of the *****ge in the XIX century is also the name of your ancestor.

I'm sure you'll be able to get a lot of help here, don't hesitate to ask;)

What would you like to know?

I will probably drive via the *****ge this weekend and can search or translate a bit.

Best regards:)

[bobby]

G'day,

Thankyou for your reply.

I can only assume Maksym Kuper & Wife, Katarzyna, Nee Waryszczak (My greatgrand parents) is buried in Kulaszne. Would like to find out if they are, or if any other Kupers are buried in the Cemetery.

Jan Kuper, was mentioned above, was shot due to Eviction regulations in 1946. I've not yet been able to find out how this kinda thing happened in 1946 - i thought the war was over in 1945?

The 1787 Austrian Cadastral Records indicate a Kuper family in Kulaszne for that year - so i can probably assume my ancestors go back to at least that date.

If you can see any Kupers Buried at the cemetery, a photo, or just to let me know whom it is and what the headstone says, would be fantastic as i'm researching my ancestors from Kulaszne.

I did click on the wikipedia link you gave (i use google translate, sometimes the translation comes up OK) , and down the bottom it gives a source - "józefińskie metrics from the year 1785" - what is this, or is this information available on the net - i would like to see if it mentions any specific information about Kupers.

Many Thanks,
Bobby.

[vm2301]

If I am at the place I'll take some photos or ask some people, no problem.

WW2 ended in 1945, later on there were fights involving Ukrainian nationalists - bloody and cruel mostly targeted at civilians.
A book could be written - and many have. If you cannot find anything yourself on the Net I'll try to help you with some resources in English.

Metryki Józefińskie - briefly speaking it is the first in Poland (late 1780s) kind of land register or katastral records and according to Wikipedia that's the source of information about the land-owners in the area on the base of which they prepered the list of residents.
I don't have the foggiest idea if it is available online and how easy it is to find it. But we can try.

In a moment I'm leavinfg for the Bieszczady and going to be back on Monday...with some info I hope;)

vm

[bartolomeo]

i thought the war was over in 1945?
It means you have to read a lot about those times. One tip: do not judge too early.

As a starting point you can use an exception (http://tiny.pl/2dkw) from the book "Cisna. Slownik Historyczno-Krajoznawczy" telling the story of Wetlina, other *****ge more or less in the same area as Kulaszne. Read only the "History" section, it's rather short. You'll find there the acronyms like NKWD (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NKWD), UPA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_Insurgent_Army) and others. The history of all *****ges in that area after WWII was similar, I guess the story of Kulaszne was like the story of Wetlina.

This article will give you the idea how that's possible that your ancestor was shot in 1946 but it'll not explain the reasons. If you're interested you'll find a lot articles about post-war fights in todays south-eastern Poland. Read relations of both sides of the fights if you want to be neutral. It may be difficult, since your ancestor was shot then...

So, do the homework ;-) and in case of questions come back. We'll try to help you, but I'm afraid we'll not give you the answers to all the questions. We're rather tourists than historians.

Regards
Bartek

PS. Some other addresses to visit: Operation Wisla (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Wis%C5%82a), Lemkos (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemkos)

[bobby]

Bartek,

I've readup on the links you have posted, thanks for that, its something i needed to do as you pointed out.

I have also subsequently posted off a few emails (within your suggested links)

The information given on the Wetlina page is pretty darn good (from a genealogical point of view). Whilst generally, i struggle to get more than a few short sentences about Kulaszne, i'm envious of what is contained on the Wetlina Page. Most interesting.

Thanks,
Bobby.

[jacob.p.pantz]

..if you have not visited yet:

http://www.lemko.org/roots.html (http://www.lemko.org/roots.html)

http://www.lemko.org/lih/lemkorg.html (http://www.lemko.org/lih/lemkorg.html)

etc.

Greek Catholic priests from *****ges near Kulaszne:
Jaroslaw Wienc
Mokre 119, 38-542 Rzepedz
phone +48 (13) 462 90 21
mobile + 48/ 691 960 077
Andrzej Zuraw
Komańcza 173
phone + 48 (13) 467 71 40
(according to http://www.cerkiew.net (http://www.cerkiew.net) )

You can also find Kulaszne on maps:
http://tinyurl.com/3albc8 (http://tinyurl.com/3albc8) (contemporary)
http://tinyurl.com/6l2hws (http://tinyurl.com/6l2hws) (about 1935)

Kindest regards,

Kuba

[bobby]

Thankyou Kuba,

I have an article from September 2006, where a Greek Catholic (orthodox?) church burnt down in Komancza - is there more than one greek catholic church in the area?

Do you recommend i write to both priests? - its best i leave no stone unturned, but its good to get locals advice. Do you know what type of information the church keeps? (birth, marriage, death information?) Provided they have some information about my ancestors, is it likely that they give out this to the public?

Also, the lemko link you gave lists my Kuper ancestors on it... living in Kulaszne.

Many thanks,
Bobby.

[jacob.p.pantz]

I have an article from September 2006, where a Greek Catholic (orthodox?) church burnt down in Komancza - is there more than one greek catholic church in the area?

Originally built as a greek catholic,
several years after world war II taken over by orthodox church
(as the greek catholic church was illegal in Poland ruled by communists)
now not far to be reconstructed:
http://forum.bieszczady.info.pl/showthread.php?p=61978#post61978
(greek catholics in Komancza have own new church now - but built also with elements of an old one from another *****ge)

There is still a number of east rite churches (tserkvas/tserkovs) in south east Poland,
both: orthodox and greek catholic.
(as well as former tserkvas used now by roman catholics
...and even by all 3 mentioned communities commonly)
I've given you these contacts, as in Kulaszne there is a greek catholic parish.


Do you recommend i write to both priests? [...]type of information the church keeps? (birth, marriage, death information?)

Normally they keep this range of information, however I realy don't know,
whether parish books survived.
(this area has really interesting history; maybe a bit to interesting)
I am not sure, if the priest speak english, either
- but I think, you should try to explore these sources.

And first of all - please study lemko.org carefully
and consider contact Lemko's organizations in Poland mentioned there.

Good luck - kindest regards,

Kuba

[bobby]

And first of all - please study lemko.org carefully
and consider contact Lemko's organizations in Poland mentioned there.


Will do so...





I am not sure, if the priest speak english, either
- but I think, you should try to explore these sources.


I'll send letters in Polish..

Many thanks,
Bobby.

[vm2301]

Hi Bobby,

I spent Sunday afternoon driving along the valley of the River Osława showing some churches to the elderly part of my guests.
I asked the driver to have a short stopover at Kulaszne and stretched my legs walking in high grass and weeds covering the most part of the graveyard.

I only had a fleeting glimpse of the area when I saw the grave of your
(great)grandfather:

http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/9031/dscf2222si0.jpg

He rests in a place apart of the main group of graves (they seem to be new) a bit down the slope going to the bottom of the valley.
When travelling by car you drive from Sanok to Zagórz and then you head for Komańcza. Driving through the *****ge of Kulaszne you get to a serpentine road going down the valley and you can see the church from the Wikipedia link. You can park the car just a few metres from it.
The cemetery is located near the church as the link I've given you says:


http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/9020/dscf2224gf6.jpg

Unfortunately, I didn't have enough time to explore the whole graveyard carefully, so I focused on the oldest gravestones sticking out the grass usually in seclusion. I found this:

http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/5254/dscf2228hd9.jpg

The gravestone plate reads that there rests Paraska Kuper (1877 - 1930) - maybe a member of your family as well?

http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/4511/dscf2229bv5.jpg


I hope to have been helpful.

If any more help needed just post your request.

Good luck in your search.

Best regards:)

vm2301

[bobby]

This is great, thankyou kindly vm2301.

The first photo (and second one) is of my grandmothers brother. One thing i've noticed is that he is refered to as Jan by family members, but on his grave stone its say Iwan? Is that the same?

Paraska could be my GGF's sister, as he was born around the same time. The inscription caught my eye, perhaps a chisel and hammer were used to get those words into the stone.

Loved the photo of Jans gravestone with the graveyard and church in the background. Nice to know where the the church is in realation to the Cemetery.

My greatgrand parents - Maksym & Katarzyna are also buried there somewhere. These are 2 photos i would love to have.

Your photos are appreciated very much, thankyou for this kind gesture.

[vm2301]

I'm going to spend in the area of the Bieszczady mountains a bit more time this summer.
If I happen to be there again I'll try to find these two graves and take some photos of course.

Eastern name Iwan (Ivan) is an equivalent to Polish Jan.

Nowadays people turn back to old tradition I guess much more than they did or could in the past and celebrate Ukrainian traditions and language.

In this cemetery and many more in this region there are graves with both Polish and Ukrainian inscriptions.
I cannot take pride in the knowledge of history or ethnography, so forgive my cursory explanation;)

But there appear those who know really a lot and can provide you with the appropriate information and links to some interesting websites...as they have done before;)

I put a photo showing the location of Ivan's grave, here you have a photo of the church taken when standing above it on the road Zagórz-Komańcza:

http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/3568/dscf2234zs4.jpg

[bobby]

vm2301 - all the photos are good for me to view as it gives me an idea of what the area looks like. Thankyou.

I found out that Jan was killed during operation Wisla. Where can i find database, or further information about Jans death. Would there be documentation about those killed during Wisla?

Bobby.

[Marcowy]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Wisla

Did you read this? The story was written quite impartially, having also a lot of useful links.

Regards

[vm2301]

Hi,

To add something to Marcowy's link:

Try IPN (National Institute of Remembrance) - they run an English website:

http://www.ipn.gov.pl/portal/en/

e.g.

http://www.ipn.gov.pl/portal.php?serwis=en&dzial=2&id=89&search=145

That's what the search engine found immediately, more careful search may bring some better results, not just a story in a nutshell.

You can contact them, they may be helpful.

Furthermore, the National Library:

http://www.bn.org.pl/index.php?menu=1

or State Archive in Przemysl

http://www.przemysl.ap.gov.pl/ev/index.html

Finally, I know that at our forum there are people who know a lot about this operation. They are certainly able to help. If you are very eager to learn something but too impatient to wait for the answer you can also try another forum - for historians this time:

http://www.historia.org.pl/forum/
(find Historia Polski -> Polska Rzeczpospolita Ludowa)

or

http://historycy.org/
(Historia POlski ->Polska Ludowa)

At least that's what comes to my mind...

:smile:

[bobby]

Thanks for the links everyone - I have just sent a email to the National Institute of Remembrance, and will followup with reading/emailing on the other links.

Thankyou.
Bobby.